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Fake guru in Iskon

The recent letter from devotee murderer Tirtha Das is quite revealing. While the aim of Tirtha's letter is to protect his close friend Radhanath Swami, what he actually does is confirm all of the allegations against him. Previously Janmashtami Das' allegations could be swept aside as the rantings of a bitter ex-devotee, some crackpot with an agenda to malign past leaders whom he didn't like. But now Tirtha Das has just corroborated every thing that Janmashtami Das has been saying, and subsequently elevated his allegations to a whole new level of credibility.

Janmashtami Das has been saying all along that he was involved in the murder conspiracy, and that he had been brought into it by Radhanatha Swami. He claimed that Radhanatha Swami was the one who personally gave him the list of people to kill and where they could be found. Such a claim sounded a little unlikely. How could anyone believe this devotee was actually recruited personally into the murder conspiracy? That was until Tirtha Das' recent groundbreaking letter was published, where he openly admitted that Janmashtami Das was directly involved along with himself in the murder plot and had been his driver on several of the hit trips. This means Janmashtami's statements regarding the murder of Sulochan and the entire conspiracy must now be seen in a completely different light. He is now a confirmed participant who is testifying as a witness against the other criminals involved in this crime - the primary criminal leader being Radhanatha Swami. His words now cannot simply be brushed aside and labeled as the rantings of an angry ex-cult member.

Further, Janmashtami Das' statements have remained consistant from the very beginning, and he never made any attempt to hide the fact that he had been recruited into the murder conspiracy and had full knowledge of it. His story stayed the same from beginning to end, even the parts where he showed himself in bad light. Compare that to the position of Tirtha Das, where he has switched his story every day of the week, and is only caught lying when he accidentally lets the truth slip out, thereby corroborating every word of Janmashtami Das. Tirtha Das now admits he has been lying all these years to protect other conspirators in this crime. Whom those conspirators are Tirtha Das doesn't mention, but he doesn't need to, because the other co-conspirator whom he has identified (Janmashtami Das) has already revealed the participants in this murder conspiracy.

There were other further shocking revelations from Tirtha Das' letter, admissions he has never made up till date:

1) There was a large conspiracy involving many people, for whom he took the blame to shield them:

"The only reason Janmastami was not prosecuted and sent to prison was because I shielded him from the authorities." – Tirtha Das, Confession Letter, December 24, 2006

Who else did you shield from the authorities? Who were the leaders who gave you the order to kill Sulochan, whom you shielded? The eye witness testimony of Janmashtami Das says that Radhanatha Swami is the main person you are shielding, and that would explain why Radhanatha Swami tried to meet with you in prison multiple times (as stated in your previous letter). From your public admission regarding Janmashtami Das' involvment in the murder conspiracy it is clear that he directly knows who were involved and who gave the order to kill Sulochana, and he is pointing all fingers directly at Radhanatha Swami, one of the main leaders of New Vrindavana at the time of the murder.

2) Till the present date he has not honestly told everything he knows about this ghastly crime. Today he is admitting there was a conspiracy with other members involved, whereas in the past he has denied this. Some foolish people like Umapati Swami said he should be forgiven for all his past crimes. But when he has not yet admitted to the real crimes, nor has he revealed the other criminals involved, why should anyone forgive him or feel sorry for him? Until he fully confesses to the details of the crime he can never be forgiven. But his ISKCON friends in high places (Radhanatha Swami, Candramauli Swami, Umapati Swami, and plenty of others) have taken good care of him. They have given him official recognition in ISKCON as a leading preacher in ISKCON prison ministries, they have published his own books through ISKCON, they have written the introduction to his book, and they have personally tried to visit him many times in jail. Why? What is their close intimate connection with the murderer Tirtha Das? Are they also some of the co-conspirators he has been covering for all these years? Why does the GBC allow such criminals like Radhanatha Swami to repay devotee murderers with ISKCON favors?

3) Tirtha Das fully admits that Janmashtami Das was directly and intimately involved in the murder conspiracy. This elevates Janmashtami Das' statements to those of a co-conspirator and direct eyewitness, testifying against other criminals whom he worked under. This is the most serious revelation in Tirtha Das' recent letter. The GBC needs to review this matter immediately and address how Radhanatha Swami can remain a guru in ISKCON while such serious charges have been levelled against him (with credible evidence and witnesses). If the GBC chooses not to investigate this matter, it shows that they are already infiltrated and controlled by Kirtanananda's henchmen (Radhanatha Swami, Umapati Swami, Devamrita Swami, Malati, Candramauli Swami, Varshana Swami, Candrashekhar Swami and others).

Further, murderer Tirtha Das had also reported the fact that his friend, Radhanatha Swami, had recently been identified by a drug sniffing dog when he tried to enter the prison to visit him. When a highly trained drug sniffing police dog identifies someone, it means that they are either carrying drugs or that they have the residue of illegal drugs on them (from personal use). The GBC should find out whether Radhanatha Swami has been personally using illegal drugs, or whether he was trying to smuggle illegal drugs into the prison to repay Tirtha Das for covering for him in the Sulochan murder.

"We deplore the fact that H.H. Radhanath Swami and H.H. Candramauli Swami have been repeatedly denied access to the Mount Olive Correctional Complex on the pretext that a drug sniffing dog alerted to the presence of illicit drugs on their persons." – Letter from Tirtha Das

I request devotees to forward this letter to all known disciples of Radhanatha Swami so that his criminal background can be exposed. In the following pages detailed evidences are providing, all pointing towards Radhanatha Swami being the leader who ordered the murder of Sulochan. Personally ordering the murder of another devotee is a terrible sin that not even Krishna can forgive. Radhanatha Swami was a neophyte rascal who publicly propagated that the pedophile child molester Kirtanananda was a pure devotee whom everyone had to worship. When devotees tried to expose Kirtanananda's child molestation, Radhanatha Swami took the matter into his own hands and ordered the killing of these devotees to silence the critics. This is the true spiritual background of Radhanatha Swami that everyone should know.

We should also note that Tirtha Das never attempts to deny Janmashtami Das' statements. Instead he just threatens Janmashtami Das that bad things will happen to him if he keeps speaking against Radhanatha Swami. He even states that he will reveal unknown secrets about the murders to the police:

"The only reason Janmastami was not prosecuted and sent to prison was because I shielded him from the authorities. However, since there is ultimately no statute of limitations on murder, should Janmastami persist in his moronic rantings, perhaps some arrangement can be made for an interview with the US Attorney's Office." – Tirtha Das, Confession Letter, December 24, 2006

Besides Tirtha Das' latest confession letter, other shocking evidences are cited below, which again point to a larger conspiracy involving Radhanatha Swami.

1) When the police arrested Tirtha Das and Tapahpunja Swami, 5 days after the murder, he had $4,000 in cash in his possession. There was also written, unsigned instructions (found on Tapahpunja Swami) that Tirtha Das should leave the country if the police start looking for him. Who gave the money to Tirtha Das to fund the murder and to flee the police? Who wrote the instructions that Tirtha Das should flee the country if the police started looking for him? Was Tirtha Das an insanse person who wrote notes to himself just in case he forgot what his plan was? It is obvious that there were higher leaders involved in the murder conspiracy, otherwise who gave the money and who wrote the note?

"Kent Police Detective Ronald Piatt and his partner said that when they arrested Drescher, they found on him "surveillance notes" describing Bryant's van, his physical appearance and his movements in Los Angeles . Drescher also carried $4,000 in cash.

With Drescher when he was arrested, Piatt said, was a Krishna priest from Cleveland [Tapahpunja Swami] who had clippings from three newspapers about the death of Bryant and written instructions of unknown origin saying that if Drescher were ever wanted by police, he should be sent to a temple in New York , then flown to India ." - Los Angeles Times, "Killing Sparks Federal Probe of Krishna Sect" (July 20, 1986)

2) Also arrested with Tirtha Das was Tapahpunja Swami (Terry Sheldon). What was Tapahpunja Swami, one of the leaders of New Vrindavan, doing hiding Tirtha Das from police in Ohio? Obviously someone had instructed him to do this, so who was it? From the note in his possession it was clear that he knew Tirtha was the murderer, and as has been stated by Janmashtami Das, he was actually one of the three devotees asked by Radhanatha Swami to kill Sulochan (the other two being Tirtha Das and Janmashtami Das). How would Tapahpunja Swami be involved in hiding Tirtha Das from the police unless there was a larger conspiracy, with a leader ordering them what to do?

3) Tirtha Das was arrested on May 27th, just five days after he had committed the murder in Los Angeles . On July 5th Tirtha Das' mobile home was burned in a mysterious fire:

"The detective added that a fire of undetermined origin burned Drescher's mobile home July 5th." - Los Angeles Times, "Killing Sparks Federal Probe of Krishna Sect" (July 20, 1986)

With Tirtha Das in prison, who was it who set fire to his mobile home to hide evidence? And who gave that order to burn his mobile home? It is obvious there was a larger conspiracy involving many other people. Who the leader of that conspiracy was will be dealt with shortly.

4) The day after Tirtha's arrest, an explosion occurred injuring one of the key witnesses against Tirtha Das:

"The principal witness, Randol Gorby, was seriously injured in an explosion at his home the day after Drescher was apprehended in Ohio , authorities said." - Los Angeles Times, "Killing Sparks Federal Probe of Krishna Sect" (July 20, 1986)

With Tirtha Das in prison, who planted the explosives? Was it all a strange coincidence?

5) In November of 1986 Sulochan's son, Nimai Bryant, mysteriously drowns at New Vrindaban, just months after his father was murdered. He didn't have any past habit of entering the water at all. Coincidentally, Chakradhari's son also died mysteriously at new Vrindavan (in 1984) just months after his father was murdered by Tirtha Das. His son was found suffocated inside an abandoned refrigerator. Is it merely a coincidence that the two people Tirtha murdered also had their sons die mysteriously within a few months of their father's being killed? It is much more likely that the conspiracy leader ordered the sons to be killed, knowing that they would grow up to avenge their father's murders, likely killing the New Vrindavan leaders responsible. Since Tirtha was in prison at the time of the drowning, then who killed Sulochan's son?

6) In sworn testimony, Tapahpunja Swami [Terry Sheldon] stated that he was the one to inform Kirtanananda about the murder plot:

"Sheldon said he participated in the surveillance of Bryant with Drescher and told Bhaktipada of the plot to kill Bryant." – Associated Press "Hare Krishna member says he acted at leader's behest" (April 18, 1996)

Thus the murder plot never came down from Kirtanananda to Tirtha Das, rather the murder plot was already decided by some other leaders who gave the order to Tirtha Das and Tapahpunja, and Tapahpunja later told this plan to Kirtanananda. This is exactly what Janmashtami Das has been saying from the very beginning:

"In January of 1986, on my return to New Vrindaban, I was ordered by Radhanath to neutralize Sulocana. Three of us were ordered by Radhanath, not by Kirtanananda Swami, to terminate Sulocana. This happened with Tapah Punja Swami and Tirtha in November and December of 1985. I was on SKP until Christmas and didn't get back to the farm until New Years. Immediately on our arrival at New Vrindaban, Radhanath sought me out and made arrangements for us to meet in his van, where he went through a prepared speech that he had delivered to Tirtha, Tapah Punja Swami and Kuladri many times before. Later talks with Tirtha confirmed this." – Janmashtami Das, "New Vrindaban History, for the Record", ( December 22, 2006)

It is now a confirmed fact that Janmashtami was the third person instructed to kill Sulochan, and this was admitted in Tirtha Das' recent shocking confession letter:

"It may be of interest to note that the author of one recent self-styled expose, Janmastami dasa, was himself a co-conspirator in the death of Sulocana, accompanying myself on several trips to California, he motoring about with various guns and cyanide for the express purpose of finding and dispatching Sulocana. The only reason Janmastami was not prosecuted and sent to prison was because I shielded him from the authorities." – Tirtha Das, Confession Letter, December 24, 2006

We saw that Tapahpunja confirms Janmashtami Das' account that Kirtanananda didn't give the order to kill Sulochan, but that someone else did. We also saw that he confirms Janmashtami Das' account that there were other people who were asked to kill Sulochan (at the very minimum Tirtha and Tapahpunja). These two points are not admitted by Tirtha Das, but now that two out of three of the hitmen have made the same admissions, it is clear that Tirtha is holding back information. We have already seen Tirtha Das admit that he has secret information about this case that he would expose to the police if Janmashtami didn't keep quiet. So it is clear who the credible witnesses are.

Taking both Janmashtami Das' and Tapahpunja Swami's admissions, we have the following:

Radhanatha Swami believed Kirtanananda was a pure devotee. When Sulochan began exposing Kirtanananda's child molestation cases Radhanatha decided he was an offender who needed to be silenced. Radhanatha Swami contacted three devotees (Tirtha Das, Tapahpunja Swami and Janmashtami Das) and instructed them to kill Sulochana. Tapahpunja Swami later took this plan back to Kirtanananda and informed him of it.

Radhanatha Swami's actions are easy to understand when one knows how much he believed Kirtanananda was a pure devotee. Even as late as 1991, five years after the murder of Sulochan, and years after Kirtanananda's child molestation was known, Radhanatha Swami still publicly glorified Kirtanananda as a pure devotee:

"Bhaktipada is a man of spirit. He is not a man of external form, and he's been training us intensely. Why do you think he changed the dress from dhotis to robes? It was for one reason-preaching in the West. But that's not all. He saw that we were attached to the concept of being a devotee based on how we look externally rather than being fixed in the spirit of devotion. Why are you sitting in chairs instead of on the floor? Why are the hymns in English instead of Sanskrit? Why is our hair an inch long rather than shaved off? On one level, it's practical for preaching in the West, but Bhaktipada had something much deeper and more profound than just that. He saw that we were ritualistically attached to our approach to God, just like practically all other so-called religious persons in this world. We thought we were devotees because of how we looked how we sang, and how we wore our hair. Bhaktipada wanted us to smash through all these external trappings and go right to the essence of the spirit of bhakti."

- Radhanatha Swami, "A Perfect Plan to Increase Devotion," New Vrindaban World, no. 8 (April 26, 1991)

7) In Kirtanananda's trial, the jury was not convinced that he was involved in the Sulochan murder conspiracy. For the RICO conspiracy count the jurors were provided a paper with a check list, where they should indicate which counts they thought Kirtanananda was guilty of. The paper looked like this:

IF YOU FIND THE DEFENDANT GUILTY OF [the
count] PLEASE CHECK THE PARTICULAR PREDI-
CATE ACTS YOU HAVE UNANIMOUSLY CON-
CLUDED HAVE BEEN PROVEN BY THE UNITED
STATES WITH RESPECT TO DEFENDANT SWAMI.

1) STEPHEN BRYANT MURDER ________
2) CHARLES ST. DENNIS MURDER ________
3) DEVON WHEELER KIDNAPPING ________
4) MAIL FRAUD: FUNDRAISING ________
5) MAIL FRAUD: ALLSTATE INSURANCE ________

The following trial document ( http://laws.lp.findlaw.com/getcase/4th/case/945507P.html ) states:

"After a trial, the jury convicted Swami on the RICO and mail fraud counts but failed to reach a verdict on the murder counts.

The jury found Swami guilty of the RICO conspiracy count and checked all of the predicate acts except the Stephen Bryant murder. The jury also found Swami guilty of the RICO substantive count (Count II) but did not check either the Stephen Bryant murder or the Charles St. Dennis murder as predicate acts."

Thus even the jury, who heard all the evidence against Kirtanananda, didn't believe he was the one behind the murder conspiracy. The jury didn't believe it.

It is already proven that there was a conspiracy, but who the leader was that gave the order is what remains a mystery. The jury did not believe that Kirtanananda was that leader who gave the order to murder Sulochan. If it wasn't Kirtanananda, then who was it? One of the co-conspirators has already confessed and stated that it was Radhanatha Swami who gave the order to murder Sulochan, and all evidence points in his direction, but was Radhanatha Swami the only one who knew?

8) When we see how past New Vrindavan leaders interact with this convicted murderer Tirtha Das it follows a very peculiar pattern. Every one of them is lightning quick to defend his character and point out his wonderful spiritual qualities. Wait a minute, is this the same Tirtha Das who brutally killed devotee Chakradhari Das (Charles St. Denis):

"Prosecutors said St. Denis was shot a dozen times, stabbed, beat with a hammer and finally suffocated with plastic wrap placed in his mouth before he was buried." - Associated Press (August 31, 1986)

Or as another reporter has described it:

"Chuck St. Denis did not die easy. Two gunmen pumped twelve .22 caliber rounds into him. He was stabbed repeatedly in the chest with a kitchen knife and a screwdriver. As the life fled from him he howled like a dog. His cranium was fractured with a hammer. He opened his eyes and spoke to his killers after they were sure he was finally dead. His killers buried him under a stream, which is probably a good way to make a spirit unquiet, if such a thing can be done." – Charles Carreon, "Killer Krishnas from Inner Space"

This is the person whom people like Malati, Umapati, Radhanatha Swami and Candramauli Swami glorify as the perfect devotee. Below is exactly what Malati (ex-Swami) says about the person who shot Chakradhari Das a dozen times, then stabbed him with a kitchen knife, then stabbed him with a screw driver, then bashed his head with a hammer, and when he still wouldn't die, wrapped plastic over his mouth to suffocate him:

"The person who was charged with and admitted to the murders of Steve Bryant and St. Denis is Thomas Drescher, aka Tirtha das, who is in prison for life. Therein lies an interesting story, should anyone care to know. But, to make a long story short, this person has undergone a deeply profound recitification and transformation. So much so that the chief prosecutor against him, Michael Stein from the District Attorney's office, feels that he is worthy of a pardon. He contacted me recently and in that conversation stated that he has rarely, almost never, witnessed a change in the character of a convicted felon, but he has seen this in the case of Thomas Drescher, who he refers to by his initiated name, Tirtha das. On his end, Mr. Drescher has become a sober humble person, accepting the results of his awful deeds (double life sentence w/o possible parole) as a befitting indication of Krishna's mercy on him." – Malati Dasi, letter to Giri-nayaka Das, December 26 2006

Umapati Swami also wrote up a nice defense for Tirtha, saying that he had immediately rejected Kirtanananda as soon as the news of his sexual misconduct came out:

"The stories of Kirtanananda's sexual misconduct came out long after I left New Vrindaban. When that happened, Tirtha rejected him and testified against him in court. Tirtha also wrote a letter to the GBC renouncing all claims to the title of sannyasi." – Letter from Umapati Swami, (December 18, 2006)

But for the rest of the sane world, they wouldn't need to wait for that information to come out in order to reject him. A normal person would have rejected Kirtanananda as soon as the talk of murdering someone on his behalf arose. This person not only heard such discussions, but actually carried out the murder personally – of multiple devotees!

Umapati offered other special favors to murderer Tirtha Das, for example initiating him into the sannyasa order in August of 1987, even after he had been convicted of murdering devotees by a court of law. Umapati Swami personally went inside the prison and performed the sannyasa initiation of Tirtha, acting as a ritvik priest on behalf of Kirtanananda.

Other ISKCON gurus are also involved in awarding Tirtha Das special favors. For example, Candramauli Swami, who is in charge of ISKCON Prison Ministries has made Tirtha one of his main highlighted preachers. If you go to the ISKCON Prison Ministries website you will see a prominent link to Tirtha's personal website displayed at the top of the page, along with many other articles written by Tirtha Das. You can also find murderer Tirtha Das featured on ISKCON's Namahatta.org, with his articles and a nice photo of him in prison.

Candramauli Swami has personally visited Tirtha Das many times in jail. He has also written the introduction to Tirtha's book, titled "The Definitive Guide to Practicing Krsna Consciousness in Prison". In addition to writing the introduction, he has also arranged for the book to be published by ISKCON. Why does murderer Tirtha Das get his book published by ISKCON? That's a good question that only Candramauli Swami can answer.

There are also reports that these former New Vrindavan leaders have been regularly supplying money to Tirtha Das even today. Even if that cannot be verified, there is enough evidence to show that Tirtha Das is being shown very special treatment by the former New Vrindavan leaders – the same leaders who may possibly be involved in the murder conspiracy.

Considering the despicable nature of Tirtha Das' crime, it is amazing that he remains a member of ISKCON in good standing, receives many visits from ISKCON Gurus and GBCs, has his book published by ISKCON, has his articles featured on ISKCON Prison Ministries website, and even has an ISKCON Guru write the introduction to his book and help him promote it. Anytime someone tries to hint that Tirtha Das is bad, these leaders jump up in his defense to tell everyone how he is really an amazing saint. Something just doesn't smell right in all of this. When we add the fact that Radhanatha Swami tried to visit him in prison, but was identified by a drug sniffing dog, then the alarm bells really start ringing. Was Radhanatha Swami trying to pay off Tirtha by smuggling illegal drugs into the prison?

"We deplore the fact that H.H. Radhanath Swami and H.H. Candramauli Swami have been repeatedly denied access to the Mount Olive Correctional Complex on the pretext that a drug sniffing dog alerted to the presence of illicit drugs on their persons." – Letter from Tirtha Das

With Janmashtami Das' testimony implicating Radhanatha as the one who gave the order to kill Sulochan, everything makes sense and fits it place. Tirtha Das has all the information on these people to put them away for life. They must give him special treatment to make sure he doesn't change his mind and let the secrets out. That special treatment may possibly go as far as smuggling illegal drugs into the prison for him. In U.S. prisons drugs are more valuable than money, they are the real currency.

9) The above clearly explains Radhanatha Swami's special affection for Tirtha, but what about these other people like Malati, Candramauli Swami, Umapati, etc.? What would they gain by showing special favors to Tirtha Das?

The answer to this becomes clear when we realize how many people knew about the murder plot. Janmashtami Das stated that after receiving the order to kill Sulochan from Radhanatha Swami, Tapahpunja immediately tried to involve others in the plot such as Yudhisthir Das from San Diego. As the trial shows, it is beyond doubt that Yudhisthir was an accomplice and knew what was going on, and that is why he was called to testify. Tirtha simultaneously contacted others in Los Angeles to involve them in the hit as well.

That many people became aware of the murder plan is also clear from how long it took the police to arrest Tirtha Das. Just 5 days after the murder, Tirtha Das was arrested in Kent, Ohio , along with Tapahpunja Swami, while preparing to flee the country. How is it possible for the police to immediately identify the name of the murderer and locate him across the country in 5 days, just from the forensic evidence at the crime scene? It is only possible if one of the many people who had been informed of the murder plot ratted him out. Where did they get the name of the murderer, the location he was hiding, and other details from? Tirtha Das and Tapahpunja had tried to involve too many people in the murder plot, and the result was they were immediately ratted out.

How does this connect to Malati and the other New Vrindavan leaders? If Radhanatha Swami is calling three separate people to kill Sulochan (Tirtha, Tapahpunja, and Janmashtami), and if they are subsequently informing many other people across the country about the murder plot, it is clear that secrecy isn't the top priority here. It is likely that Radhanatha Swami may have first consulted with senior leaders of New Vrindavan before ordering the hit, to get their opinion and approval. These leaders would include people such as Malati, Devamrita Swami, Candramauli Swami, Umapati Swami, Kuladri, Bhakti Tirtha Swami, and others. This would clearly explain why all of these people are in a rush to defend Tirtha, to provide special favors to Tirtha, and to always keep Tirtha happy in prison. He knows that they were all involved or in a position to know about the murder conspiracy, and if he ever develops a dislike for them, then he will reveal their involvement, just like he threatened to reveal the involvement of Janmashtami Das.

Malati has already admitted that she is aware of some secrets involving the murder that she hasn't mentioned:

"For that matter, there is a strong contingent of persons who insist that "Janmastami" was directly involved in the murder of Steve Bryant, although never charged." – Malati Dasi, letter to Giri-nayaka Das, December 26 2006

She clearly knows details she is not revealing, and is subtly trying to threaten Janmashtami to keep quiet or face the consequences. Why else would she mention such a thing? Let her identify "the strong contingent of persons" who informed her of this inside information so we can have a list of the criminals involved in this case. Unfortunately the list of names will include Radhanatha Swami, Devamrita Swami, Candramauli Swami and herself, so she will never give us that information.

In an attempt to discredit the eye-witness testimony of Janmashtami Das, Malati tells us all about his villainous past, and concludes that he is like a mad dog:

"To describe him in one word would be to say that he is deranged. He is like a mad dog." – Malati Dasi, letter to Giri-nayaka Das, December 26 2006

But what Malati fails to mention are her own transcendental qualifications: the fact that she is a lesbian infected with HIV (AIDS) due to excessive intravenous drug use, and the fact that she was previously one of Kirtanananda's female sannyasis, Malati Swami. Such hypocrisy, seeing that they are surrounded by murderers, pedophiles, homosexuals and drug addicts.

10) Conclusion: The only way for the devotees to solve this case and to remove these corrupt murderers from power is if the ISKCON GBC insists that all participants undergo a polygraph test and answer questions about the murder. People who should be questioned include:

Tirtha Das
Tapahpunja (ex-Swami)
Radhanatha Swami
Malati (ex-Swami)
Devamrita Swami
Candramauli Swami
Kirtanananda (ex-Swami)
Umapati Swami
Kuladri (ex-Swami)
Janmashtami Das

If all of these devotees are allowed to tell their stories and be questioned while simultaneously undergoing a polygraph test we will be able to find the answers once and for all to who was involved in this despicable crime of murdering a Vaishnava. Refusal to take the polygraph test should be viewed by the GBC as admission of guilt, and the individuals should be expelled from ISKCON permanently. If they have nothing to hide, then why would they fear taking a polygraph test to prove their innocence? All circumstantial evidence points to Radhanatha Swami as the leader of the murder conspiracy. It is up to these suspects to voluntarily take the lie detector test and establish their innocence.

(

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Started Oct 7 2008 by:

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cBrahma

Permalink Reply by cBrahma Jan 11
 

Your idea is good in principle but it has two serious flaws -
1) The assumption that the GBC are in the least interested in the truth
2) That polygraph tests are infallible.

We don't need polygraph. There are public records and eyewitness accounts. If one had been in ISKCON around that time and experienced the strong-armed tactics of the so-called authorities - in any of the 'Zones' one realizes that all these gurus and their associates were complicit in major deception. Thinking that multiplying the guru system by 8 is a cure to the corruption is laughably aburd. A fish stinks from the head down. Those in deepest complicty are the GBC. Until that cadre of criminals is dismantled there is no hope.
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Aishwarya Kumar

Permalink Reply by Aishwarya Kumar Jan 26
 

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Tom Jay

Permalink Reply by Tom Jay Feb 9
 

I've got 10000 disciples, said a guru I once met,
I gave them all Diksha, though I seem to forget
their names and their faces since they are so many.
Says I, to me it seems that they are two-a-penny.

Does a father not remember the names of all his children?
Does a brother not know the faces of his brethren?
Let me ask you, oh Guru, how is it that you claim
To lead me and to guide me, and not even know my name?

I chant and do my rounds, aye, my heart's filled with devotion
But if I'm just another face in this impersonal ocean
Then how can you claim that you're teaching us the Dvaita
If I am just the same as him, that surely that's Advaita!

The power that you wield is not your possession
Your are merely feeding a megalomanic obsession
I say to you: seek quality, not quantity, my friend
It is souls that you are guiding, not pigs in a pen

Don't herd us like cows, though sacred they might be
Don't spread lies in my house, because quite rightly
Your ego will defeat itself and expose your hollow lies
And in the end you will be stripped of your saffron disguise

So my friend, be honest and tell us what you know
Free yourself of your illusion, and liberate your soul
And please, my Fellow Man, do not think that I am a nitwit
For I know you're not a Guru, at most you are a ritvik.

Like Jesus in his anger broke the ranks of farisees
And drove them from his temple, and brought them to their knees
You too will be broken once the masses start to rise
And though you can run, you can never hide

For truth illuminates all the hearts that are still open
And yes, we can hear all the words you left unspoken
You can't pick and choose whatever teachings may befit you
So be honest, and be open, and your faith may yet redeem you

The True Guru doesn't boast and he doesn't have to brag
He is happy with a bowl and shawl, even when he's dressed in rags
Satguru is eternal and he needs no body
Yet his truth will fill you up just like your mum's chapati.

Hare Krishna!

"There will be a time when ritviks shall be ritviks, gurus shall be gurus, and little green furry gremlins shall be little green furry lemmings."
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cBrahma

Permalink Reply by cBrahma Jan 28
 

How dare you take that sanctimonious attitude about cheaters that have damaged the legacy of Bhativedanta Swami Prabhupada with all sorts of nefarious activities. Dedicated their lives? To what? Misleading others into thinking they are saintly when they are criminals? You need to get your understanding of what is a devotee straigthened out. It's because of such ignorance and naivete that these cheaters can prosper.
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cBrahma

Permalink Reply by cBrahma Jan 28
 

"Guru parampara as cheaters"
They are no such thing. You are an endoctrinated fanatic.
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Aishwarya Kumar

Permalink Reply by Aishwarya Kumar Jan 29
 

This reply was deleted

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Aishwarya Kumar

Permalink Reply by Aishwarya Kumar Jan 29
 

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Aishwarya Kumar

Permalink Reply by Aishwarya Kumar Jan 30
 

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Manjunath

Permalink Reply by Manjunath Jan 30
 

Hare Krishna!

I beg pardon from all the Vaishnavas if at all i am commiting any offense against any Vaishnava.

Please answer to my one single Question!

In any bonafide parampara, currently there should be one single spiritual master who gives initiation. Similar to one supreme lord Sri Radha Krishna Chandra.

Can i know how many people are intiating now and to how many people should we do abhisheka, puja and arati saying Sakshad Dharitvena, Sakshad Dharitvena? I dont think that the position of Spiritual master is so cheap that there will be numerous gurus existing simultaneously in a single parampara and that too in a single temple.

Thank you!

Hare Krishna!
Tom Jay

Permalink Reply by Tom Jay Feb 9
 

The key is that no matter who initiates you in ISKCON, you will be a disciple of Srila Prabhupada. So your initiation is still valid, but you are not the discipline of the ritvik that initiated you. It seems to me that the concept of "initiating GURU" was created for political purposes.
kathuria

Permalink Reply by kathuria Jan 30
 

no fake guru only is Lord Shankar. its reality
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Acyuta Krsna Dasa

Permalink Reply by Acyuta Krsna Dasa Feb 9
 

The whole guru system in ISKCON is false, voting in a guru? Ridiculous to presume such a process is bonefide.

We do need real sadhu sanga to progress not mindless following. We cannot look for a guru, Sri Krsna gives you association of liberated souls as you yourself become more advanced through Hari Nam. You go looking for it and you will be cheated. Bring the focus back to the self and chant to reveal the truth.

Anyone who wants to, can worship a fallible man but personally I choose the harder path, the path of truth to oneself. Worship the primeval Lord not some dog pretending to be God.
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Nilesh Narayan

Permalink Reply by Nilesh Narayan Feb 11
 

Hare Krishna

I agree with u Acyuta. This whole gurus system is ridiculous. I have seen some young kids been seen as gurus.

I have been mislead many times while searching for a guru. You cannot trust a person just because he is a guru. He has to be real bonefide master.
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Acyuta Krsna Dasa

Permalink Reply by Acyuta Krsna Dasa Feb 12
 

Exactly Nilesh Ji, how can we choose an off the peg a guru - its ridiculous!! A guru who has positioned himself to be a guru is a joke as he is only after prestige etc...

We cannot trust as we have imperfect senses so when we are ready Sri Krsna will almost force us into that relationship - we will have no way of avoiding it. Whatsmore a bonafide guru will have many signs to show he is bonafide, for a start he will unify all vaisnavas not divide them.
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Nilesh Narayan

Permalink Reply by Nilesh Narayan Feb 13
 

A Guru is just a human being. He is a servant of GOD but not GOD.

Why should we follow some self appointed idiot who thinks he is superior to us.

U never know what's hiding inside a Gurus Dhoti.
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Acyuta Krsna Dasa

Permalink Reply by Acyuta Krsna Dasa Feb 13
 

The biggest offence IS to consider a true Guru as human, what if the guru is a kanishta-adhikari, or at best madhyam human. What then, oh yes - dont question he is not to be doubted! A true Guru is uttama-adhikari and would be firmly established in the behaviour of one on such a level, if this is the case then yes he could be worshipable, this means he is Jagat or Sri Guru. We cannot be blind to this, what are the qualities of such a soul, what signs are there to determine or discover such a personality.

To determine this we MUST question and debate - this is the process, it is a regulative science not gopi-bhav.
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Aishwarya Kumar

Permalink Reply by Aishwarya Kumar Feb 13
 

This reply was deleted

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Nilesh Narayan

Permalink Reply by Nilesh Narayan Feb 13
 

Aishwarya Kumar ur name is very sweet for a male.
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Acyuta Krsna Dasa

Permalink Reply by Acyuta Krsna Dasa Feb 13
 

lol - he is very sweet Nilesh and more importantly speaks the truth in all discussions, not like Subala who is so indoctrinated that he cant even see his own nose.
Basically bogus gurus prove that they are not qualified through their actions. On the other side of the coin Nilesh a real bonafide guru can exist as it has been proven many times that acarayas come on Sri Krsna's order to re-establish religious principles. If this is the case we as serious devotees need to question the existing bogus gurus but at the same time be open to the slim chance that a bonafide acaraya will come. I really feel sorry for him when he does come, as the system will kill his body as surely as they did Srila Prabhupadas and Srila Gaur Govinda Maharajas.
Oh - my birth name was Ashley, which is also a bit feminine lol
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Manjunath

Permalink Reply by Manjunath Feb 13
 

Yes, you do need association of pure devotees of Sri Radha Krishna Chandra. Actually by now you should have understood the actual meaning of the Vaisnavas.

Vaishnavas means pure devotees of Sri Radha Krishna Chandra. Pure devotees of Sri Radha Krishna Chandra means they are always interested in the glorification of the Supreme Lord Sri Radha Krishna Chandra without desiring any self respect towards themselves. Infact a pure vaisnava blasphemes himself to be the most fallen person.

On the other side we see many bogus vaisnavas who do everything to glorify themselves (even go to the extent of killing Guru to become Guru) and in the process they forget their actual duty which is gorification of the Supreme Lord Sri Radha Krishna Chandra.

The humbleness of a devotee should be such that he should consider himself lower than a dog and glorify the supreme Lord Radha Krishna. (Considering doesnt mean that his activities also should be like that, As we see in few of them today).

Sada Kirtaniyah Harih. A devotee should be continuosly glorifying the Lord and his pure devotees (Vaisnavas). Then he is pure Vaisnava.

Anyway it is hard to find a pure Vaisnava for the association. So I recommend you that for now you consider all Vaisnavas as neophytes (Kanishta Adhikaris) and simply associate with Srila Prabhupada who is present in his books. Infact there is a that a book is a best friend of everyone and Srila Prabhupada is present in that form by his teachings. So please preserve him safely.

Thank you.

Yours in service of Srila Prabhupada & Lord Krishna.
Manjunath
manjunath.ph@gmail.com
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