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fake guru in iskon

Recently Dandavats.com posted a diary entry from Indradyumna Swami titled "Mysterious Antiques". As most devotees are aware, Indradyumna Swami has an ongoing habit of writing self promotional material under the guise of a "diary". The sole purpose of the diary is really to advertise himself and attract prospective disciples and donors. Much like Radhanath Swami and his "wonderful stories" that aim only to show how advanced he is, Indradyumna's writings also are just a collection of fabricated tales made to show how Krishna personally guides the advanced devotee - who happens to be none other than himself. The target audience is obviously the new and neophyte bhaktas who don't have enough philosophical training to spot such self promotion.

Recently Rochan prabhu has been highlighting this new style of "devotional writing", where there is no real philosophy and the sole aim is to promote oneself as a highly qualified guru. Satsvarupa has always been the senior expert of this genre. He has written perhaps a hundred books of useless gobblygook. Now that is truly a case where you really do need a guru decoder ring to understand what he is speaking - it is all nonsensical gibberish. Besides Satsvarupa, other prominent guru campaigners have followed similar styles, with Indradyumna being very prominent, and Radhanatha doing the same in spoken form (knowing his disciples will transcribe it and send it to all the faithful). Last week we had also highlighted Umapati's useless writings on his personal website (www.umapati.net), which contained plenty of utterly mundane topics, such as an article where he spoke about JonBennet Ramsey. So it is clear that this style of writing has become prominent in ISKCON, and is replacing the focus of new bhaktas. Instead of spending their time studying Srila Prabhupada's books, they are catching up on the lastest antics of their favorite superheros.

In the above cited diary entry of Indradyumna Swami, all I see detailed are the ignorant wanderings of a rich american in a third world country. That's the only real message I got out of it, nothing spiritual at all. For example, one of the subjects of the article is how he spent $200 to buy a tiger's tooth necklace to bring him protection. It is not only against international law to purchase or transport products made from endangered species, but it is also sinful to kill an animal just to make a fancy necklace. It is amazing that the Swami didn't have the material nor spiritual insight to figure this out:



As we turned to go I noticed a peculiar item on his desk.

"What's that?" I asked.

"It's not for sale," he replied.

"I just want to know what it is," I said.

"It's an old tiger's tooth," he said.

"In a silver casing with a chain," I said.

"Yes," he said. "It belonged to a king hundreds of years ago."

"Is it special?" I said.

"Very special," he replied.

"How so?" I asked.

"The person who wears it will never be troubled by bad dreams," he said. "He'll be blessed, and his dreams will be good."

"Wow!" said Dhruva. "That's incredible!"

I thought about my bad dreams the previous two nights. I couldn't resist looking closer at the mysterious tooth.

"Can I hold it?" I asked.

The man picked up the tooth and put it in my hand.

It was large and dark yellow, and the silver casing had ornate carving all over it. It spoke of antiquity.

"Thanks," I said and handed it back. We turned and started to walk to the door.

"Are you interested in buying the tooth?" the man said.

"No thanks," I said as we started to open the door. "I'm sure it's too expensive."

"Just wait," the man said. "I'm willing to let this piece go for cheaper."

Dhruva and I stopped and turned around.

"I think he needs the money," Dhruva whispered. "Looks like no one ever comes here."

"How much?" I said.

"Two hundred dollars," the man said.

"That's pretty cheap," Dhruva said.

"Not in Bangladesh," I said. "It's one of the poorest countries in the world."

"I'll buy it for you," Dhruva said, and he walked back in the store. After paying for the tooth, he came back and handed it to me.


Indradyumna Swami could have taken the opportunity to tell his disciple, Dhruva, that it is illegal to own a product made from an endangered species. He could also have told him that it is sinful to kill an animal for the sake of making a fancy necklace. Or at the very least he could have told him that one should not waste Srila Prabhupada's money for material enjoyment. But he didn't tell any of these things, he happily took the new fancy silver necklace and put it around his neck.

This displays another huge problem in ISKCON. ISKCON Gurus are stealing money that should go to Srila Prabhupada's movement, and instead diverting it for their own sense gratification. Spending $200, which is around 10,000 rupees (enough money to run a small ISKCON temple an entire month in India), on personal fancy jewellery is hardly the best example one would expect from a sannyasi. We have countless examples of past ISKCON "Gurus" purchasing golden plates for themselves to eat off of, expensive clothes, jewellery, and so many other nonsensical things, most of which are later given away as "prasadam" to the cute looking lady disciples. The fact that Indradyumna didn't even blink or hesitate a second when spending $200 US dollars to buy himself fancy jewellery shows it is a regular spending habit. It's clear that this isn't the first time he has spent money like this, he has a lot of experience spending money whimsically. These false gurus are often surrounded by neophyte disciples who are eager to serve their gurus by buying them unique and exotic things. Unfortunately, the fake gurus take advantage of this kind sentiment and engage their disciples in buying all sorts of mundane things like Tiger's teeth necklaces. This money should really be directed towards the lotus feet of Srila Prabhupada, but instead it buys fancy jewellery for ISKCON sannyasis.

We should note that originally Indradyumna doesn't even know what the jewellery is, yet he is so attracted to it. He wrote:



"I just want to know what it is."




So even though he has no idea what this fancy, shiny jewellery is, this sannyasi has an immediate attraction for it and starts the process of purchasing it, knowing his disciple is there to foot the bill.

Let us now look at the philosophical message Indradyumna Swami presents in this diary entry. He wrote:



"The person who wears it will never be troubled by bad dreams," he said. "He'll be blessed, and his dreams will be good."

I thought about my bad dreams the previous two nights. I couldn't resist looking closer at the mysterious tooth.




Indradyumna Swami doesn't have faith that for protection devotees should chant Lord Krishna's holy name and pray to Srila Prabhupada and Lord Nrisimhadeva. Instead he feels an expensive talisman, a tiger's tooth necklace, is what is really required for devotees to be protected from bad dreams. What type of nonsense is Indradyumna Swami teaching to his disciples by his words and actions? If Lord Krishna's names cannot protect Indradyumna Swami from bad dreams, then nothing in this universe can protect him. Or perhaps the problem is he isn't actually chanting Lord Krishna's names anymore, like many of the other GBC and gurus. Whatever the case, it is clear by his actions that his faith in the transcendental potency of Lord Krishna's names is very small. He feels that the real solution to all his problems are not in Lord Krishna's name, but in a special talisman, an illegal Tiger's tooth necklace.

Next we would like to study Indradyumna's level of common intelligence. He writes about the Tiger's tooth:


"Yes," he said. "It belonged to a king hundreds of years ago."






And later he writes about several pairs of deities which "must be hundreds and hundreds of years old", which he later bought for $100 US Dollars. Anyone who has experience living in third world countries knows this is the oldest trick in the book. There are many special factories where they manufacture deities and make them appear old or antique using various chemicals. In India it is common to find people selling "antique coins" dating from hundreds of years ago. They sit with piles of them at many holy places, selling the coins to foolish tourists. The reality is they are all brand new forgeries, treated by chemical processes to appear old. Indradyumna falling for the line about his tiger's tooth previously belonging to a king hundreds of years ago shows he is just a foolish American in a third world country waiting to be ripped off. Later when he falls for the same line about the deities, it just confirms his stupidity. In there countries the customs officers are specifically trained to catch the smuggling of antique dieties, which are usually valued well above $15,000 US dollars each. The thought that Indradyumna found a real set of deities that were hundreds of years ago, and bought them for a mere $100 USD is hilarious. If they were even made from high quality brass, they could have melted them and received more than $100 USD just for the metal. The fact is they are made from cheaper metal combinations, primarily zinc, but given a high grade external polish to look nice (and ancient) to the tourists.

A few other portions of the diary entry caught my eye and deserve comment. For example this line which shows that Indradyumna just globe hops like a rich hippy, with no particular predesigned plan. Suddenly hop on a plane and go for an adventurous vacation at the expense of the disciples' donations:


Later in the day, I telephoned my disciple Dhruva das to ask about the possibility of visiting another holy place in India before our scheduled Vrindavan parikramas in Kartika. We talked about Haridwar, Tirupati, and Udupi. Then suddenly I had an inspiration.

"Let's go to Bangladesh," I said, "and visit the great saint Narottam das Thakur's birthplace in Keturi.




The following also shows that Indradyumna was more interested in going to the tourist resorts than visiting the ISKCON temple. He could have easily waited another 2 minutes to find a taxi that was willing to take him to the ISKCON temple, but instead he just said, "show me the beautiful tourist spots":


There was a lot of traffic and we waited a long time for a taxi. "Let's go to the temple," I said to Dhruva as we finally stepped into a taxi. But the driver refused.

"Is it dangerous to drive there?" I said.

"Not today," he replied. "But it's too far and I'm stopping work soon."

But neither Dhruva nor I wanted to wait on the street any longer. "Then take us to a
beautiful part of the city," I said.

The driver laughed. "There's not much beautiful about this city," he said.

"Well then," I said, "take us where the tourists go."

"What tourists?" he said.


So rather than try to go to the ISKCON temple for preaching and associating with devotees, this ISKCON sannyasi asks to go to the beautiful tourist areas in the city. Again, the fact that there is no hesitation on the part of Indradyumna Swami shows he has a lot of experience going to beautiful tourist places while he travels. Otherwise, how would that be his immediate next response.

At the conclusion of the diary entry, Indradyumna lets us all know what was the final lesson his dear disciple learned from him on the trip:


"Dhruva!" I said excitedly. "I just had an amazing dream. I dreamt we were on Harinama in a Muslim village. As we chanted through the village all the people came out of their houses to sing with us. They were singing 'Allah Akbar!' and we were singing 'Hare Krishna.' We all joined hands and danced together in bliss. It was so vivid!"

Dhruva looked at the tiger's tooth around my neck. "Guru Maharaja," he said, "that's exactly what the man said would happen if you wore that tiger's tooth. Just imagine if we'd been able to get the peacock feather, the coin, the deity of Ganesh, and the special pot that neutralizes poison."


Indradyumna had previously highlighted these magical items, all being sold by the "antique dealer", as follows:


"I can show you some unusual items," he said, "but I have to go home to get them. I don't keep them here."

"Like what kind of interesting things?" Dhruva asked.

"I have a centuries-old coin," he said. "If you put grains on it, they'll immediately disappear."

"Is that true?" Dhruva said.

"I also have a peacock feather that casts no shadow."

"Wow!" said Dhruva.

"I have a deity of Ganesh that doesn't appear in any photo you take of him."

"Really?" said Dhruva.

"And I have a pot that neutralizes poison."

"Neutralizes poison?" said Dhruva.


So in conclusion, the message we really get is this: "Geepers, if we had just managed to collect all the magical crap that the antique fellow was selling then our Krishna consciousness would be perfect!" That's the final conclusion we get from Indradyumna. The purpose of Krishna consciousness is to wander the globe like a hippy, going in search of talismans, magic beans and mystical pixie dust. This is the essence of Indradyumna's fabricated "diaries of a traveling preacher".

At the very beginning of his diary entry, he began by stating:


"Going to India is more of a necessity than a luxury for one in the renounced order of life."




What in his description is anything but a luxury? A rich, globe hopping American who roams like a hippy, living off the expense of foolish disciples, and squandering Srila Prabhupada's money for fancy illegal jewellery. All glories to Indradyumna Swami.
(Keywords: Hare Krishna, ISKCON, Indradyumna Swami)

posted by Govinda Das at 12:06 PM | 18 comments links to this post

Friday, December 22, 2006
Another Pretender Guru Falls Down

Again word from Mayapur that another false guru, Bhakti Vidya Purna Swami, has fallen down with an underaged minor. If it had occurred in the United States the criminal would be subjected to a prison sentence. But since it has happened in India, and under the protection of the GBC, it is swept under the carpet and forgotten. It's not that people weren't aware of what was going on. For months people had been seeing Bhakti Vidya Purna Swami going around with this girl, him riding a motorcycle with her sitting on the back, right up next to him, cruising the back roads of Mayapur. Every single resident of Mayapur had seen it, and they all knew, but he was needed to run the gurukula, so they just let it go. I guess they were happy that at least he wasn't a homosexual, like the last three Mayapur Swamis (Bhavananda, Nitai Chand and Satadhanya).

A few months ago some of his disciples had complained to me that he was spending the entire day, from morning till evening, at the all-girls school, "teaching" the girls Bhagavad Gita, just so he could be around this girl. That's a lot of Bhagavad Gita to be teaching these young girls, wouldn't you think? From morning till evening. And then there were the secret rides out into the sunset with the girl on the back of his motorcycle, which everyone was aware of. Most of the people running the school were his disciples, so they couldn't say anything. They just silently went along and said, "Oh well."

The Mayapur management needs him to run one of the last few boys gurukulas left in ISKCON, so I wouldn't expect any push on their part to punish him. The word is it will be called an "accidental falldown", and not need to be disclosed to the public. This way they can keep the whole event internal, just amongst the Mayapur community, without having to really punish him or close the boys gurukula. These "accidental falldowns" seem to be quite common nowadays. Satsvarupa was also involved in an "accidental falldown", whereby he was able to hold onto his fake guru post and fake sannyasa. Till this day Satsvarupa is certified "as good as God" by the GBC. Suhotra Swami is another member of the "accidental falldown" guru club. Coincidently he also lives together with Bhakti Vidya Purna Swami at the Mayapur gurukula. After Suhotra's falldown, he had pledged to rededicate himself to sannyasa vows under the direct personal guidance and supervision of Bhakti Vidya Purna Swami. I guess that wasn't a very good idea, was it?

Suhotra had a special bonus with his accidental falldown, he got a nifty new pada title to add to his name. His actions had actually been so ridiculous that they couldn't cover it up and let him remain a sannyasi, but at the same time they didn't want to say he fell down. So they said he "downgraded himself to vanaprastha." What exactly does it mean when a sannyasi downgrades to vanaprastha? They could have just said he was caught going to prostitutes, but that wouldn't have sounded as advanced. So instead they decided to "downgrade him to vanaprastha". At the same time they wanted to cover up the fall down, so they announced that the GBC had awarded him a new name in recognition of his "severely austere nature". From now on he would be known as Tapovanacari - "the vanaprastha who does severe austerities (tapasya)". Yes, he is now Suhotra Das Tapovanacari - not just regular vanacari, but TAPOvanacari. So the good news for Bhakti Vidya Purna Swami is if he is lucky he may end up with a nifty new pada name like Suhotra got.

What's the lesson for the rest of us small time ISKCON devotees to learn? I really don't know. It's tough to figure out a spiritual moral from this, but maybe it's this:

If you go along with the corrupt GBC, you can remain a guru and sannyasi even if you are engaged in illicit activity. But if you happen to think Srila Prabhupada is the primary spiritual master of all devotees, you are banned, beaten, and thrown out of ISKCON forever. How long will everyone keep pretending things are getting better? When will you realize the GBC is corrupt from top to bottom. Just like they cover the falls of these small time gurus, they are also covering the falls of the bigtime gurus as well. How many disciples really know who their guru actualy is - what type of person is he? You see them for one day a year as they zip by to receive their yearly worship and dakshina from you and your temple. Do you have any idea how your guru lives, what he actually does, or anything at all about him? No. You see him for an hour a year, and you only see the big guru show they put on as they pass through.

It is a fact that the majority of ISKCON gurus no longer live in ISKCON temples, but have private houses where they stay with a few servants to take care of them. It is also a fact that the majority of high profile ISKCON gurus are multi millionaires. Take for example Bhakti Caru Swami, who a couple months ago pledged to donate $1,000,000 USD of his personal money to the GBC to be used for the child abuse court case. Where does someone like Bhakti Caru get $1,000,000? And do you think he is completely giving 100% of his total money? No way. If he is giving one million dollars that means he is sitting on 30 or 40 million dollars. Gaudiya sannyasis are traditionally known as "Tridandi Bhikshu", which literally means "street beggar", and several ISKCON millionaire sannyasis even print this title on their letterheads.

It is time for ISKCON devotees to see that the present gurus are looting Srila Prabhupada's movement of all it's finances. Why are the temples throughout the world struggling to stay open, and struggling to pay the bills? It is because all of the local money is sent off to these rich gurus. They initiate the local devotees, and then suddenly the temple loses it's donation base as the money is sent to millionaire gurus with swiss bank accounts. Money that should be going to build up Srila Prabhupada's temples locally is instead being sent to false Swamis who use it to continue their lives of sense gratification.

(Keywords: Hare Krishna, ISKCON)

About This Discussion

Started Oct 7 2008 by:

swamysqa swamysqa
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Nitesh

Permalink Reply by Nitesh Oct 8 2008
 

Your observation about Indradyumna swami and other iskcon gurus are quite awkward....I mean before you even try to voice out your useless opinion about him or any guru who are giving out their life for Srila Prabhupada's pleasure...i would like to ask what contributions did you make to this krishna consciousness your self??? To how many conditioned materialistic and misery ridden did you give relief by giving them the treasure of devotional service???? How many devotees of Krishna did you make in your life and how many materialist did you convert in to followers of Caitanya Mahaprabhu....How many temples did you open for the sheer pleasure of Srila Prabhupada????? How many times did you risk your life in muslim countries just trying to preach the message of Lord Gauranga????? And mind you I already know the answers are a big zero just like you who are a big good-for-nothing, useless and shameless zero who doesn't do anything but just open their big mouth to let out all the garbage filled in their minds against those who are toiling hard to do save stupid Pagal-babas like you from unlimited miseries. Sitting in front of your keyboard and spilling all kinds of rubbish on the net is pretty easy. so first try to convert one materialist polish in to chanting the maha mantra maybe then you would become a tiny little bit qualified to utter the name of Indradyumna swami. Or i guess you are just a stupid ritvik who although having been put to shame by Jayadvaita swami time and again still jackal-like shamelessly come for more kicks....

Hope i haven't been too close to reality in your case....
your well wisher
Sridoyalnitai
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Nilesh Narayan

Permalink Reply by Nilesh Narayan Nov 23 2008
 

Hello Mate

Everyone is a fake Guru. We all are fake and liars especially the Hare Krishna movement. They claim that Krishna is the real GOD but many people don't realise that in the Bhagavad Gita, several places it's mentioned that Vishnu is the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Srila Prabhupada himself says that and he himself was a Vishnu monk.

So where is the truth mate???? In hinduism there is Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva so where Krishna fits. You see so many devotees chanting the Hare Krishna mantra on the streets. Where did they get that from. Is is mentioned in the Gita or any other scriptures. Prove me if I am wrong in any of the above issues.
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Sreevalsa Kolathayar

Permalink Reply by Sreevalsa Kolathayar Nov 25 2008
 

namasthe.................
srikrishna parabrahmane namah

dear Nilesh Narayanji,

it is not wrong to consider krishna as supreme. krishna is parabrahman, the absolute truth. radheshyam radhesyam.
.why we should think whether krishna or vishnu is supreme? both are one and the same. while i worship krishna, i used to chant vishnu sahasranamam. vishnu purana says that krishna is an incarnation of vishnu. Bhagavatham dont see any difference in vishnu and krishna. Bhagavatham address krishna as narayana and narayana as krishna.

'ekam sadviprah bahudha vadanthi'---Rigveda
sivapurana says siva as supreme, devibhagavatham Ma Shakthi, vishupuranam vishnu .........These forms are saguna and sakar forms of one and the same paramathma (parabrahmam) which is nirguna and nirakara. we should worship God in saguna forms.krishna rama siva or jagadamba are not different or separate from parabrahmam. i consider bhakthi even greater than mukthi.

Madhwa devotees consider vishnu as supreme and krishna as paripoorna incarnation. ISKCON devotees consider Krishna as supreme. Shaiva and Shaktheya devotees consider siva and shakthi as supreme. Advaitha devotees worship vishnu, shiva, shakthi, ganesha, surya as Parabrahmam. They see no difference in these forms. they follow absolute monism rather than monotheism or sectarianism.bhakthi is perfect when advaita bhava arises.
we should not see any difference in these forms of Paramathma..worship krishna/ rama/ vishnu/ shiva/, ganesha/ karthikeya/ Ma Durga........(any one or more understanding that all are one) with deep devotion.
see God every where and in every one.
'sarvabhutheshu ya pashed bhagavadbhavamathmanah'....SrimadBhagavatham...

Then reply to your comment abt harekrishna manthra.

Kalisantharanopanishad says

hare rama hare rama rama rama hare hare
hare krishna hare krishna krishna krishna hare hare

it is true that ISKCON devotees chant harekrishna first. there is no wrong in that. i use to chant
hare rama hare rama rama rama hare hare
hare krishna hare krishna krishna krishna hare hare

whatever you do do it with cheerfulness and wholeheartedness with devotion to bhagavan. keep samabhavana and do our work as worship and help others seeing bhagavan and self in every one.
remember ram and chant bhagavannam always.

ramram
har har mahadev
radheshyam
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bhakt abhay

Permalink Reply by bhakt abhay Oct 9 2008
 

Hare krishna

Where do u stay??
.Why dont you come down to our Iskcon temple and talk face to face,if u think you are so intilegent and we are on wrong path.
I am From Juhu Iskcon IYF,mumbai.If u are staying in Mumbai come down to our temple.Lets talk face to face.Lets see how much Scriptural knowledge you have.
You can come along as many friends and people you can.

You are here not to gain knowledge but to fight with us.Krishna conscious website can only give Fair Information about krishna conscious mission.Its not possible to make some one understand things in Deep Details through internet.Only by having discussion personaly and personaly meeting can solve our problem.

hare krishna
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Nilesh Narayan

Permalink Reply by Nilesh Narayan Nov 25 2008
 

Hare Krishna

Who do u think u are?? Are u an incarnation of Krishna that u think u could challenge anyone.
Get a life mate. All Hare Krishna devotees are bunch of idiots.
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Nitesh

Permalink Reply by Nitesh Oct 10 2008
 

Dear Baladev Prabhu
As far as i know Srila Prabhupada also was very much concerned about money. in fact, he was extremely meticulous about how money was used because he considered it to be krishna's energy... Even Srila Prabhupada was criticised for it. Some said why a renunciate like him should travel in a Rolls Royce. His own godbrothers were unable to understand him rightly. So it is not surprising at all that Srila prabhupada's disciples are being criticised npwadays... epecially by people who can't even achieve even 1/10 of what the So called kangurus of iskcon are doing...And we ISKCON people too can say a lot about those who are really good at stealing our devotees...But i guess we have more important and pressing things to do for Srila Prabhupada's pleasure than lecturing about the defects of others....
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bhakt abhay

Permalink Reply by bhakt abhay Oct 10 2008
 

Hare Krishna
Swamysqa.

Prabhu i am sorry on behalf of any devotee who might have,Knowing or unknowingly hurted you.
Or anywhere.Please forgive him/her.

You seems to be very enthusiastic.You do have lot of intrest in philosophy.I like that.
Prabhu whats your Good name.My name is Abhay Deolekar.I am from Mumbai.
I am a active but Insignificant servant in ISKCON-JUHU IYF(ISKCON YOUTH FORUM)
If you don't wana share your name its ok.

Prabhu if ur staying in Mumbai,do let me know.So that i give you my contact no.

We have a Program called 'Aradhana' every Sunday in evening around 5.00 condcuted by H.G Praneshwar Das (B.E Mech).He is a very nice Devotee.

We can have discussion.Also Sri Sri Radharasbhihari provides Prasadam to everyone.So dont worry about dinner.We will serve you Free Delicious Krishna Dinner Prasadam.

Prabhu its very easy to ask Multiple questions on Net but difficult to convience a person by answering him.
Only if a person have discussion,a person to person discussion personaly will bring out good disccusion.
You ask questionas innocently but some devotees here might misunderstand your questions.And that will create a Fight.And we dont wana fight,u know that.
Fighting is Dog's nature.And we are Human beings.Human means Wise man.So Human Beings means being like a Wise man.And you know Material knowledge dosent make us Wise man.

I Aplogise if i have hurted you by my Comments or by this scrap.

Please do reply me.

Your Servant and Friend
Bhakt Abhay.
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bhakt abhay

Permalink Reply by bhakt abhay Oct 10 2008
 

Prabhu.I respect a Lot very Much to Sri Gour Govinda Maharaj,Srila Narayana Maharaj Prabhupada and Srila Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada.
You too know.That all of them are connected to eachother Spiritualy.
Srila Narayana Maharaj has helped Srila Prabhupada in his Krishna Conscious Mission in many ways.
All the Helpfull works are described in Srila Bhaktivedanta Swami's Lilamrita.
Prabhu none of the ISKCON GBC members teach us to blaspheme Any Gaudiya Maath Vaishnavas.
As they are same as We are.
Yes i am in Real ISKCON.ISKCON is not any Illusion.ISKCON is one river coming from Srila Bhaktisidhanta Swami Prabhupada.
Gour Govinda Maharaj and Srila Narayana maharaj has contributed so much for ISKCON-srila prabhupada's mission in initial State.
Every ISKCON devotee knows that.
So why to discriminate among ourself??
Lets do Krishna bhakti happily and bring more and more people in krishna bhakti.You do the same thing even we do the same thing.
I am a aspiring Disciple of H.H Indradyumna Swami Maharaj.

Your servant
bhakt abhay
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bhakt abhay

Permalink Reply by bhakt abhay Oct 10 2008
 

Hare Krishna Baladev Prabhu.
Its all right.I thought so, there was some mis-understanding.Its not at all possible that any GBC member blaspheme Maha Bhagvata Devotees.
GBC meeting is from 18 oct in ISKCON juhu temple.Me with my other IYF friends have given a seva to serve them Prasadam.
I will ask them abt these.
GBC dosen't think any Bad about Gaudiya Maths.You remmeber at the time of living these material world,Srila Prabhupada apologise and call upon all his Godbrothers.Srila Prabhupada told his disciples that not to Blaspheme Gaudiya math devotees at any cost.
Because GBC memebers too told us these message of Srila Prabhupada long back ago and so do i respect Gaudiya math and so many others ISKCON devotees.Neither any Gaudiya Math Gurus blaspheme or comments any bad on ISKCON gurus.

Its all made up stories of bloddy Ritviks.they make rift between us.There are so many made up videos on net.
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bhakt abhay

Permalink Reply by bhakt abhay Oct 12 2008
 

Hari Bol Baladev Prabhu
You said"im sorry if you became ofended. I really made a mistake about who start this"

Yes you have offended me and Our Guru Maharaj's.You are not less than a Dog Stool.

You said"But gbcs can not understand this,may be because the lot of ofenses they made to Maha Bhagavatas devotees."

You bloddy Rascal.How u dare to talk such things.You just meet me someday i will kick your Filty butt.
I have no respect for you and neither of your 'Dhongi Gaudiya matha'.
At any cost you not gona elevate yourself in spiritualism and as you have offended my Guru Maharaj's ,i wont let you progress.You will allways fall down.You remember these.You will always take birth on earth much lower than animal species.Even after taking initiation you shamelessly go on offending vaishnavas!!?

Who are you to decide who is not and who is a Vaishnava.Your Dog Stool thinking that ISKCON devotees are not Vaishnavas that not gona make us Non-Vaishnavas.
Our Guru Maharaj's and GBC members work hard day and night.Thats why we have so many Devotees.100 times more than you people have.

You said"Bhaktisiddhanta Prabhupada have many Bona Fides Gurus like your Prabhupada,My Gurudev,my Parama Gurudevas B.R.Sridhar Maharaja,B.P.Kesava Maharaja.B.P.Puri Maharaja and so many others.We are a one family, but gbc and others from your iskcon can not or by some cause,dont acept this."

Yes Bhaktisiddhanta Prabhupada have many Bona Fides Gurus like our Srila A.C Bhaktivedanta Prabhupada,Your Gurudev,Your Parama Gurudevas B.R.Sridhar Maharaja,B.P.Kesava Maharaja.And GBC's do accept them.They never denied it.It's people like you,who is trying to create False flaws in it.

You said"We have so many prooves records in Tapes ,videos etc.. that they are ofensive to the Maha Bhagavatas of Gaudiya Math."

The tapes are Your people's made up tapes to blaspheme ISKCON and Srila Prabhupada, you Dog Shit.
You people can't even make A good nice False tape.By just seeing the made up tapes any one can come to know that it is False tapes.You and your Pig Brothers are jealous of ISKCON-Srila Prabhupada's Mission success,popularity and Huge number of followers.Its has happened because Srila Prabhupada always have Blessings of his Guru Maharaj and ISKCON sanyasis and GBC senior members and Other devotees Allways helped him to Bring these success.

You said"May be today they are more humble and can admit some thing.I know that they proibited all iskcon devotes to go him.You can make a test.Say to your guru that you are going see my Gurudev in Kesavaji Gaudiya Math in mathura and see what will be the answer.We know what they think about us,may be they omit to your disçiples,but we from Gaudiya Math know what these gbc think about us"

They were allways humbled,they are allways humbled and they will be allways humbled and they admit all things regarding Krishna Bhakti.They dont like to waste there time Talking on Non-sensical things as Dog Shit like you and your Scoundrel brothers do.And why the hell should i say My Guru Maharaj that i am going to see Gaudiya Matha people why?We are happy in ISKCON.We are happy.we are not inclined to Any other Organisation.
People Like you,who were first in ISKCON and rather than being servant you allways seek to get Material opulence,Pleasure and respect, left ISKCON.These is the True reason why you left ISKCON beacuse you didn't get the desire post or respect you wanted.And you dont like to serve some senior devotees.
After Eating the Pure Salt of ISKCON from ISKCON devotees,you say it taste like a Shit.You shameless.Though you might be following vaishnavism(Which you are Factualy not) but your thinking is totaly mundane.You want to enjoy worldly Matters which u didnt got in ISKCON,so Gaudiya Matha Bought you.Like some shameless People Buys Prostitutes from the street.You are much equal to Prostitute.

They may think anything on you.why you are concern.You do your Bhakti.Why you are coming in ISKCON website.Go and Preach on your Organisation website.Why a Father will let his Child go to some Unknown person???Father allways teach his child never talk to Unknown person.Its for the child safety.Isin't it???
So if i ask My guru Maharaj that should i go to Gaudiya matha,yes he will ask why u wana Go?And why should we ISKCON devotees should come to Gaudiya matha?Just beacuse some handfull useless People like you left iskcon and join Gaudiya Matha???Why u asking me to take test to my Guru maharaj??!!!! My God!!! your thinking is so Dirty.That means you yourself dosent trust you own guru maharaj?I trust my Father(Gurur Maharaj).I dont have to go to Pathalogical laboratory to find out my real father,as you did.ISKCON Guru Maharaj Are Also Real Sucessors of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Maharaj through Srila A.C Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada.

You said"we dont want to fight,we will be tolerant,humble,and only will folow Bhaktisiddhanta Prabhupada´s words with full faith."

Hahahahahahha My God you are realy Funny person.I didn't know Gaudiya Matha have also gave birth to Clowns and have started there own Circus.See who is talking about Humbleness and tolerant.

Next time i See you Speaking anything about or Blaspheming our GBC members and Our Guru Maharaj.I will bring out your True colours.And U rascal there is No need to Create any Flaw accounts to Blaspheme ISKCON.

Note:Watch out my Words next time.

Hare krishna.
Reply to This
bhakt abhay

Permalink Reply by bhakt abhay Oct 11 2008
 

Prabhu can u please tell me what i need to read exactly on that website.Or give the specific link.I cant see the video as my Net is slow.
Reply to This
Nitesh

Permalink Reply by Nitesh Oct 12 2008
 

Dear Baladev,
Let's assume for one minute that there are fake gurus in ISKCON. But what about Gaudiya Mathas???? Without wanting to be offensive I'd like to ask you a question and would expect you to answer most sincerely if you can....IN THE GAUDIYA MATHAS THAT YOU ARE FOLLOWING: ARE ALL THOSE ACTING AS GURUS REALLY GENUINE?????
If YES then You should consider yourself really fortunate. But If the answer is NO, which i'm sure is by the way, then you better clean in front of your own doorstep rather that try to come point fingers at others....
Just as Srila Bhakisidhanta Sarasvati Thakura Mahasaya rightly puts it: "Judge not lest you be judged"
Reply to This
Jayanta Sanyal

Permalink Reply by Jayanta Sanyal Oct 11 2008
 

That's really nicely written. You are getting closer to Krishna Chaitanya. I feel that you should not bother what the Gurus are doing but just listen to their lectures and strengthen your own Krishna Consciousness. Many great sages in the past fell down in their practices. I myself fell down , but I kept my chanting going. Lust will always be there. Just keep yourself focussed on Krishna and you will be fine. Hare Krishna! Prabhu, if I can't support your thoughts then Krishna will! Believe me! He Will! Have a blissful day and chant the holy name! Whenever, I read such distress comments by devotees I chant the holy name so that Krishna will bless them and they will be liberated. You can't win in this Kaliyuga. You have to take shelter of Krishna.
Reply to This
bhakt abhay

Permalink Reply by bhakt abhay Oct 12 2008
 

To Baladev Das
Hari Bol Baladev Prabhu
You said"im sorry if you became ofended. I really made a mistake about who start this"

Yes you have offended me and Our Guru Maharaj's.You are not less than a Dog Stool.

You said"But gbcs can not understand this,may be because the lot of ofenses they made to Maha Bhagavatas devotees."

You bloddy Rascal.How u dare to talk such things.You just meet me someday i will kick your Filty butt.
I have no respect for you and neither of your 'Dhongi Gaudiya matha'.
At any cost you not gona elevate yourself in spiritualism and as you have offended my Guru Maharaj's ,i wont let you progress.You will allways fall down.You remember these.You will always take birth on earth much lower than animal species.Even after taking initiation you shamelessly go on offending vaishnavas!!?

Who are you to decide who is not and who is a Vaishnava.Your Dog Stool thinking that ISKCON devotees are not Vaishnavas that not gona make us Non-Vaishnavas.
Our Guru Maharaj's and GBC members work hard day and night.Thats why we have so many Devotees.100 times more than you people have.

You said"Bhaktisiddhanta Prabhupada have many Bona Fides Gurus like your Prabhupada,My Gurudev,my Parama Gurudevas B.R.Sridhar Maharaja,B.P.Kesava Maharaja.B.P.Puri Maharaja and so many others.We are a one family, but gbc and others from your iskcon can not or by some cause,dont acept this."

Yes Bhaktisiddhanta Prabhupada have many Bona Fides Gurus like our Srila A.C Bhaktivedanta Prabhupada,Your Gurudev,Your Parama Gurudevas B.R.Sridhar Maharaja,B.P.Kesava Maharaja.And GBC's do accept them.They never denied it.It's people like you,who is trying to create False flaws in it.

You said"We have so many prooves records in Tapes ,videos etc.. that they are ofensive to the Maha Bhagavatas of Gaudiya Math."

The tapes are Your people's made up tapes to blaspheme ISKCON and Srila Prabhupada, you Dog Shit.
You people can't even make A good nice False tape.By just seeing the made up tapes any one can come to know that it is False tapes.You and your Pig Brothers are jealous of ISKCON-Srila Prabhupada's Mission success,popularity and Huge number of followers.Its has happened because Srila Prabhupada always have Blessings of his Guru Maharaj and ISKCON sanyasis and GBC senior members and Other devotees Allways helped him to Bring these success.

You said"May be today they are more humble and can admit some thing.I know that they proibited all iskcon devotes to go him.You can make a test.Say to your guru that you are going see my Gurudev in Kesavaji Gaudiya Math in mathura and see what will be the answer.We know what they think about us,may be they omit to your disçiples,but we from Gaudiya Math know what these gbc think about us"

They were allways humbled,they are allways humbled and they will be allways humbled and they admit all things regarding Krishna Bhakti.They dont like to waste there time Talking on Non-sensical things as Dog Shit like you and your Scoundrel brothers do.And why the hell should i say My Guru Maharaj that i am going to see Gaudiya Matha people why?We are happy in ISKCON.We are happy.we are not inclined to Any other Organisation.
People Like you,who were first in ISKCON and rather than being servant you allways seek to get Material opulence,Pleasure and respect, left ISKCON.These is the True reason why you left ISKCON beacuse you didn't get the desire post or respect you wanted.And you dont like to serve some senior devotees.
After Eating the Pure Salt of ISKCON from ISKCON devotees,you say it taste like a Shit.You shameless.Though you might be following vaishnavism(Which you are Factualy not) but your thinking is totaly mundane.You want to enjoy worldly Matters which u didnt got in ISKCON,so Gaudiya Matha Bought you.Like some shameless People Buys Prostitutes from the street.You are much equal to Prostitute.

They may think anything on you.why you are concern.You do your Bhakti.Why you are coming in ISKCON website.Go and Preach on your Organisation website.Why a Father will let his Child go to some Unknown person???Father allways teach his child never talk to Unknown person.Its for the child safety.Isin't it???
So if i ask My guru Maharaj that should i go to Gaudiya matha,yes he will ask why u wana Go?And why should we ISKCON devotees should come to Gaudiya matha?Just beacuse some handfull useless People like you left iskcon and join Gaudiya Matha???Why u asking me to take test to my Guru maharaj??!!!! My God!!! your thinking is so Dirty.That means you yourself dosent trust you own guru maharaj?I trust my Father(Gurur Maharaj).I dont have to go to Pathalogical laboratory to find out my real father,as you did.ISKCON Guru Maharaj Are Also Real Sucessors of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Maharaj through Srila A.C Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada.

You said"we dont want to fight,we will be tolerant,humble,and only will folow Bhaktisiddhanta Prabhupada´s words with full faith."

Hahahahahahha My God you are realy Funny person.I didn't know Gaudiya Matha have also gave birth to Clowns and have started there own Circus.See who is talking about Humbleness and tolerant.

Next time i See you Speaking anything about or Blaspheming our GBC members and Our Guru Maharaj.I will bring out your True colours.And U rascal there is No need to Create any Flaw accounts to Blaspheme ISKCON.

Note:Watch out my Words next time.

Hare krishna.
Reply to This
bhakt abhay

Permalink Reply by bhakt abhay Oct 12 2008
 

Hare Krishna
Chaitanya Caritamrta Adi lila 17.31

tåëäd api sunécena
tåëäd api sunécena
taror api sahiñëunä
tåëäd api sunécena
taror api sahiñëunä
amäninä mänadena
kértanéyaù sadä hariù

(These is the Original Quote Baladev Das,why are you Adultering it by Disappearing middle quotes?)

One should chant the holy name of the Lord in a humble state of mind, thinking oneself lower than the straw in the street; one should be more tolerant than a tree, devoid of all sense of false prestige, and should be ready to offer all respect to others. In such a state of mind one can chant the holy name of the Lord constantly.

Factualy These Wonderfull Shloka is More Important for People Like you.'amäninä mänadena' should be ready to offer all respect to others,so how much respect do you give to Our Sanyasis and GBC memebers.Its Good that Some one Wise Men have Banned some People hehehhehe.They deserve it.
If a Ant like me can Preach so Wonderfully there are Millions/Zillions of ISKCON devotees who are Very Senior too me and are Preaching at a Higher Level than me.What to talk about our Sanyasis and GBC members,They were the Associates of Sri Sri Chaitanya mahaprabhu.just in Mumbai there are Lakhs of devotees(And the count is on),Now imagine our No of devotees in each and every city,state,countries.No need to tell you how much ISKCON centers we have all around the World.ISKCON By grace of Srila Prabhupada and ISKCON sanyasis and other Senior Devotees is preaching at a Higher rate and Magnitude.RPM(Rotation per month)of making people Krishna Conscious is Speeding high!!!
Can't you preach on your own to other people who dosen't know Krishna consciousness without Blaspheming our ISKCON sanyasis and ISKCON senior devotees??
Please Do your work nicely and remember 'amäninä mänadena'Respect other Devotees.

Your friend
Bhakt Abhay
Hare krishna
Reply to This
bhakt abhay

Permalink Reply by bhakt abhay Oct 12 2008
 

Just beacuse you unnecesarily Blaspheme our ISKCON Guru Maharaj's and ISKCON devotees,I have Thrashed you.
Or else there was no Need to write all these things.I would have tolerated if you would have even Abused me but you Directly put your dirty hand on our Guru Maharaj and ISKCON senior devotees by Calling them 'Kanguru of ISKCON!!!'.

Next Time you Dont dare to Say those Dirty things again or else i have Much Harshed Words than these and i will keep on thrashing and slaping you from these Bhurloka till Patalloka.Understood?
Reply to This
cBrahma

Permalink Reply by cBrahma Nov 22 2008
 

Your understanding of the proper behaviour of sanyassis and gurus is exactly in keeping with what I have understood from Prabhupada and his uncorrupted disciples such as Rocana prabhu (who by the way used to be my temple president in Canada). Rocana prabhu is a brahminical and scholarly Vaisnava who is one of my important sikshas. Furthermore I had the dubious pleasure of attending a so-called Bhagavatam lecture by Indradyumna Swami at the Los Angeles Temple. He preempted the Bhagavatam reading with a reading from his latest auto-biography. I found the whole proceeding very offensive. His dancing was similarly extragavant and showy, especially when compared to the dignified and humble dancing style that Prabhupada adopted and encouraged. Indradyumna Swami and so many like him are pursuing rock star careers under color of the sanyassi ashrama. It is the most blatant symptom of ISKCON corruption.
Reply to This
Nitesh

Permalink Reply by Nitesh Nov 23 2008
 

Dear Ray Lanthier,
I feel so sad to hear your comments. i wonder whether your siksha guru Rocana das prabhu would agree with your comments about Indradyumna Swami. Prabhupada himself gave permission to his disciples to sing the maha mantra in European tunes so as to attract western people into the Hare Krishna Movement. So where is the problem in that.
Srila Prabhupada used to love his disciples who took great pains to preach and push his movement forward. And indradyumna Swami risked his own life in different occasions while preaching in Poland and certain muslim countries. And he does this just to please Srila Prabhupada who instructed him to preach boldly.
Devotees like maharaj are doing some concrete effort for the movement and their efforts are showing results too.
Before criticising such devotees we should consider whether we can achieve even 1 percent of what they are doing. Or can we even live as they do. If We can't then We'd better chant our rounds and try to become better devotees instead of putting forward faulty and defective opinions about them.
By the way the activities of the devotees are not less glorious and instructive than the Bhagavatam. Upto to Scholarly Rocana Das prabhu to prove me wrong.....
Reply to This
cBrahma

Permalink Reply by cBrahma Nov 23 2008
 

As swamysqa has pointed out, Rocana prabhu has publicly posted his denunciation of Indradyumna Swami's autobiography.

"Recently Rochan prabhu has been highlighting this new style of "devotional writing", where there is no real philosophy and the sole aim is to promote oneself as a highly qualified guru."

you said:
"Before criticising such devotees we should consider whether we can achieve even 1 percent of what they are doing."
Yes I have heard that defense before - so much nefarious activity in the name of 'pushing on the movement'. One thing is sure- Prabhupada was very strict about the conduct of sannyasis. Do I need to post examples? Even Bhaktipada 'pushed on the movement' and got people to chant, etc...
But Prabhupada would not consider it a fair exhange - to commit so much offense - just because Krsna is using that soul to bring others to him - "Everyone follows My path in all respects, O son of Prtha." (Gita 4:11)
This is no justification. Indradyumna is able to 'accomplish so much' , in your estimation, because he has been given position and power which he abuses.
Give any advanced soul that position and power and he/she too can accomplish - without publishing autobiographies and making a sham of the sannyasi ashrama.
ISKCON has covered so much of its corruption with that excuse of not committing offense. But it only works one way - the authorities get off scott free and the rank and file must suffer judgment and censure for speaking out against the scandalous derailment of Prabhupada's movement.
Reply to This
Bhakta  Krishna

Permalink Reply by Bhakta Krishna Dec 3 2008
 

Hare Krishna devotees,

I am really happy to read all the articles everyone has sent in here,I keep wondering what is happening,I visited 5 Temples in Africa,I cried,African Devotees are crying,suffering to mentain a temple,ISKCON is not sending money to african to build srila prabhupada's temples,this hard working preachers from Africa,built all the temple by their effort.

And some devotees are here spending Money on frivolous and temporary things of life.

I wish I have not made a mistake taking to this part.
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